Betroom 24 Casino - Τα κέρδη μπόνους παίκτη έχουν ακυρωθεί.

Hi Casino guru I hope you can help in this matter because I feel unfairly treated.

I received a weekend bonus 50% for 200 euros, ie 300 euros in total with 25x sticky wager. I hit big and met the rollover requirement on the 25xwager. I look under my profile to make sure I'm clear of wager now and that I have raw cash to play with. (see attached document)

I then pay 2800 euros out of 3 rounds because the max is 1000 they are paid out like this (1000, 1000, 800) and keep 200 euros in the account. Then I take a break of 20-30 min.

In the meantime, I have received a message from the casino that they write "This is to confirm that the withdrawal request was received by 3 rounds due to 3x payment as shown above. (See document)

In my good faith because I believe I have met the play-through requirements and to have money paid out, I choose to buy a few bonuses for the remaining 200 euros. I lose a little and win a little and end up with 450 euros ish, so therefore I decide to cancel my payout on the 800 euros and pay out 1000 more instead. Atlså I now have 250 left in the account which will also be paid out in the end. So 3250 euros in total.

The next day I wait anxiously for my money, but instead an email arrives where they write "we are writing to you regarding your recent withdrawal request.

Please be informed you have taken advantage of our Weekend Bonus Party and certain rules apply to it.

As per our Bonus Terms and Conditions under section 10.4.5., "Bonus buy feature" and "bonus hunt" are forbidden while the bonus is active on the player's account.

10.4.5 Each bonus in Weekend Bonus Party is "Sticky" which means player can not request cashout before wagering requirements has been met. Bonus restrictions, maximum betting limit of 4 €, "bonus buy feature", "bonus hunt" and forbidden games apply until the withdrawal request has been processed or when players balance reach zero out threshold which is set to 1 EUR or equivalent in other currency .

You have made a bonus hunt and played bonus buy feature on multiple slots, therefore we had to retract your winnings generated with mentioned bonus and put your initial deposit back to your balance.

We strongly advise you to read our Bonus Terms and Conditions thoroughly before playing with any bonuses, to avoid unpleasant events like this one. "

Here I would then say that as soon as I have met the play-through requirements and made a payout (which they receive) then I have RAW cash and therefore I may well buy bonuses. (and even if not, they should only withhold the 450 I bought for, the rest I paid out immediately and took a short break.)

If I'm wrong and this is just me fooling around, I'm sorry for the post and for wasting your time. But hope you can help.

Sincerely. Benjamin

Hej Casino guru jeg håber i kan hjælpe i denne sag for jeg føler mig uretfærdig behandlet.

Jeg modtog en weekend bonus 50% til 200 euro , altså 300 euro i alt med 25x sticky wager. Jeg ramte stort og fik opfyldt gennemspils kraven på de 25xwager. Jeg kigger under min profil for at sikre mig at jeg nu er clear fra wager og at jeg har raw cash at spille med. ( se vedlagt dokument )

Jeg udbetaler så 2800 euro af 3 omgange fordi max er 1000 de udbetales således , ( 1000, 1000, 800 ) og beholder 200 euro på kontoen. Derefter holder jeg en pause på 20-30 min.

I mellemtiden har jeg fået en besked fra casino at de skriver "This is to confirm that the withdrawal request was received af 3 omgange pga. 3xudbetaling som vist foroven. ( se dokument )

I mine gode tro fordi jeg mener jeg har opfyldt gennemspilskrav og at fået penge udbetalt, vælger jeg at købe nogle få bonusser for de resterende 200 euro. Jeg taber lidt og vinder lidt og ender med 450 euro ish, så derfor beslutter jeg mig for at cancel min udbetaling på de 800 euro og udbetale 1000 mere i stedet. Atlså har jeg nu 250 tilbage på kontoen som også bliver udbetalt til sidst. Altså 3250 euro i alt.

Dagen efter venter jeg spændt på mine penge, men i stedet kommer der en mail hvor de skriver "we are writing to you regarding your recent withdrawal request.

Please be informed you have taken advantage of our Weekend Bonus Party and certain rules apply to it.

As per our Bonus Terms and Conditions under section 10.4.5., "bonus buy feature" and "bonus hunt" are forbidden while the bonus is active on the player's account.

10.4.5 Each bonus in Weekend Bonus Party is "Sticky" which means player can not request cashout before wagering requirements has been met. Bonus restrictions, maximum betting limit of 4€, "bonus buy feature", "bonus hunt" and forbidden games apply until the withdrawal request has been processed or when players balance reach zero out threshold which is set to 1 EUR or equivalent in other currency.

You have made a bonus hunt and played bonus buy feature on multiple slots, therefore we had to retract your winnings generated with mentioned bonus and put your initial deposit back to your balance.

We strongly advise you to read our Bonus Terms and Conditions thoroughly before playing with any bonuses, to avoid unpleasant events like this one."

Her vil jeg så mene at så snart jeg har opfyldt gennemspils krav og lavet en udbetaling ( som de modtager ) så har jeg RAW cash og derfor må jeg godt købe bonusser. ( og selv hvis ikke så burde de kun tilbageholde de 450 jeg købte for, resten udbetalte jeg jo med det samme og holdte en kort pause. )

Hvis jeg tager fejl og dette bare er mig der har dummet mig, så beklager jeg for indlægget og at jeg har brugt jeres tid. Men håber da i kan hjælpe.

Mvh. Benjamin

Dear benjaminpetersen60,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I fully understand how difficult the whole situation must be for you. I carefully checked the Bonus Terms on the website, and this is what I found:

„10.1.12 Abuse of offered bonuses or free spins will not be tolerated. Bonuses and free spins are intended to play with. Players are not allowed to collect and/or combine bonuses. Bonuses are active until withdrawal request has been processed or when players balance reach zero out threshold which is set to 1 EUR or equivalent in other currency. If any abuse is detected all winnings will be forfeited and the bonus will be inactivated. Deposits may be returned to the player´s account. Irregular play is considered as bonus abuse. Some Examples of types of play considered as irregular play. a) Using any betting system or placing even money bets on any game of chance, b) Using the "Double-Up" or "Buy Free Spins functions" or "Bonus Hunt" (collecting bonuses with intention to later open it all) or gamble feature within a game over maxbet which is 4 EUR or equivalent in other currency c) wagering on games that do not contribute towards wagering requirements or games with a 0% wagering weight applied to them."

Would you be so kind and clarify what type of in-game features you activated? Could you please forward your game history to kristina.s@casino.guru? If there’s any other relevant communication between you and the casino, please forward it as well.

Thank you in advance for your reply.

Best regards,

Kristina

Thank you very much for your reply. I'm writing you an email with game history and other questions.

Regards Benjamin

Tusinde tak for svar. Jeg skriver en mail til dig med spilhistorik og andre spørgsmål.

Hilsen Benjamin

Thank you very much benjaminpetersen60 for your email. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Matej who will be at your assistance. I wish you the best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction soon.

Thank you very much. I anxiously await. I hope as the case can be resolved, otherwise I really have to consider where I am playing as this incident in my eyes is unacceptable from the casino side. Looking forward to hearing from you! 🙂

Tusinde tak. Jeg venter spændt. Jeg håber da sagen kan løses, ellers må jeg virkelig til at overveje hvor jeg spiller henne da denne hændelse i mine øjne er uacceptabel fra casino side. Glæder mig til at høre fra jer ! 🙂

Hello Benjamin.

I am very sorry to hear about your troubles.

The mistake you made is widespread in casinos with sticky bonuses. Especially if you were used to playing in casinos with classic bonuses.

However, we believe that you didn't gain an unfair advantage in this case, and the casino should pay you.

I would like to invite the casino representative into the case.

Could you please check Benjamin's log and give us the casino statement on this case?

Hi there,

Joshua here on behalf of Betroom24. As for the mentioned player there is not much we can add here.

As already confirmed by the player and casino.guru it came to breach of Betroom24 Bonus Terms and Conditions.

To make it shorter, according to clause 10.4.5 player was not allowed to make "bonus hunt" or used function "bonus buy feature" for the time bonus was active whic means until his withdrawal request has been processed or his balance reach zero out status which is set to 1 Eur. Whether he had finished bonus wager or not, has nothing to with mentioned claused above.

To avoid such moments we strongly recommend to players to read our bonus T&C carefully before claiming any of our promos.

Our decision is final and can not be reversed.

Thank you for understanding.

Joshua

Betroom24 Team

I still can not understand where I have broken your rules. Replay the entire bonus amount 25x times and clear wager. Then I requested more payments as you have received, processed and even sent mail confirmation about this.

So you would not be nice to elaborate on which machine and at what time I should have broken your terms at? I certainly think it is unfair treatment on your part since I have met all your requirements but you still refuse to pay money.

Jeg kan stadig ikke forstå hvor jeg har brudt jeres regler henne. Gennemspille hele bonus beløbet 25x gange og clearede wager. Derefter anmodede jeg om flere udbetalinger som i har modtaget, behandlet og endda sendt mail bekræftelse herom.

Så vil i ikke være søde at uddybe på hvilken maskine, og hvad tidspunkt jeg skulle ha brudt jeres vilkår på? Jeg synes bestemt det er uretfærdig behandling fra jeres side eftersom jeg har opfyldt alle jeres krav men i nægter stadig at udbetale penge.

Dear casino representative and Benjamin.

I understand that your casino has something written in the terms and conditions, but please both sides look at the problem from different angles. 

Benjamin finished the wagering of the bonus and made a withdrawal. If he didn't do anything after setting the withdrawal, the money would reach his account. However, he decided to play the restricted games with the rest of the money. Is it fair to confiscate all of his bonus money? We believe that the fair would be to void the remaining funds but honour the withdrawal.

We are very well aware that some casinos (mostly on the RTG platform) have problems with the bonuses and innovation in the software. Because of that, most of these casinos cannot convert bonus money into real money after the wagering is complete. However, these technical difficulties shouldn't be transferred to players. 

If Benjamin had played in most other casinos, this problem would not occur. After the wagering of the bonus funds is complete in most casinos, the bonus money will be automatically converted into real money, and players can play all games without restriction.

So dear casino representative, we have over 4000 casinos in our database. In most of them, this situation couldn't happen if your position is that this is our terms and we can't do anything regardless of the fairness. How can we promote you as a good casino?

Hi CasinoGuru,

We encourage our players to read Betroom24 Bonus Terms and Conditions prior to claim any of our bonuses to avoid situation like this one. In case there are things which are not clear to any of player, we have livechat support ready 24/7 and also Security Department works almost 24h a day.

As a serious company and casino we have no room left to decide in favour of any player if he evidentically breach bonus T&C. Our reputation will dramatically go down if we play "by the wind" with each of similar cases (there are less than 0.001% of all players which claim bonuses)

Please note Betroom24 Bonus Terms and Conditions are not just "something written" like you express your opinion in a very "subjective" way, (over limits perhaps?) but it is official document which needs to be respected and obeyed by the customers which agreed to such Bonus T&C when claiming any of our bonuses.

Betroom24 does not hide Bonus Terms and Conditions and operate by legislation in a fair and positive way. We respect every of our player and we strive to entertain our players in a positive and enjoyable environment.

Betroom24 considers this case as closed and will have no further comment under this topic.

Thank you for undertstanding,

Regards

Joshua

Betroom24

Hi casino guru and betroom24.

I have tried to see it from a different angle. Even if they think I have still violated their "bonus terms" this should be clearer or otherwise so the player understands that when you have finished playing through your winnings you can do nothing but pay them out as you are obviously still on bonus terms and still subject to Max bet and prohibited from purchasing bonuses.

I mean like casino guru writes that you should pay out the remaining amount which I did not play for but got paid out immediately.

I still insist that it is unfair treatment on the part of the casino, if you think it is over and there is nothing more to do then it is an annoying way to lose 3200 euros. Such an annoying way that I can no longer see myself having to be able to use your platform going forward.

I do not know if it is completed from the casino guru side? At least I'm tired of the casino just running away from the problem. But thank you so much for the help, did not get exactly the answer I had hoped for but the casino is clearly escaping from the problem. Too bad.

Hej casino guru og betroom24.

Jeg har prøvet at se det fra en anden vinkel. Selv hvis de mener jeg stadig har overtrådt deres "bonus vilkår" burde dette stå tydeligere eller på en anden måde så spilleren forstå at når man er færdig med at gennemspille sine gevinster kan man ikke andet end at udbetale dem eftersom man åbenbart stadig er på bonus vilkår og stadig er underlagt Max bet og forbudt at købe bonusser.

Jeg mener ligesom casino guru skriver at i burde udbetale resterende beløb som jeg ikke spillede for men fik udbetalt med det samme.

Jeg holder stadig fast i at det er uretfærdig behandling fra casino side af, hvis i mener den er afsluttet og der ikke er mere at gøre så er det en ærgerlig måde at tabe 3200 euro på. En så ærgerlig måde at jeg ikke længere kan se mig selv skulle kunne bruge jeres platform fremadrettet.

Jeg ved ikke om den er afsluttet fra casino guru side? Jeg er i hvertfald godt træt af at casino bare flygter fra problemet. Men tusind tak for hjælpen, fik ikke lige det svar jeg havde håbet på men casino flygter tydeligvis fra problemet. Ærgerligt.

Dear Joshua and Benjamin.

We again cross-checked everything, but our position is on the side with Benjamin, in this case.

An example:

If you deposit money to the bank and on your account appears only half of that money and later on discover that the bank has a rule that all deposits made on Monday have a 50% fee and all other banks are deposit fee-free. Then this rule is definitely not fair and doesn't matter that the bank has it on their terms.

I understand entirely why Benjamin feels cheated.

Joshua, I understand that you have rules, but when in 99% of casinos this situation couldn't happen then I believe it's time to change the terms. 

Hi Matej,

I would not expect from CasinoGuru to make any comparison to other casinos or even banks, giving subjective opinion, taking position on one side or another but simply follow and explain the rules of our company under brand Betroom24 to players who writes complaints.

Brainstorming about our Bonus T&C does not change the fact that the rule is written.

Please note Betroom24 Bonus Terms and Conditions are not just "something written" like you express your opinion in a very "subjective" way, (over limits perhaps?) but it is official document which needs to be respected and obeyed by the customers which agreed to such Bonus T&C when claiming any of our bonuses.

Whether player believes he is right afterall, he can turn to our License Issuer and make complaint directly to them. Until then, Betroom24 considers this case closed.

Regards

Joshua

Betroom24

Joshua, thanks for the explanation - however, any casino can't just write to their terms and conditions whatever they want. In our rating, we consider multiple factors: how safe the casino is and how user-friendly the casino is are also factors. In both those criteria, your casino failed. I have no doubts that the regulator would decide in your favour. Curacao regulators are famous for their decisions which absolutely do not care bout what is right or wrong, only about what was written somewhere.

But technically, you have right, and that's why we are closing this case as unresolved but with classification "against fair gambling codex". That means that you acted regarding your terms, but the rule you used was considered unfair. (lower penalization)

I am very sorry, Benjamin, that we could not help you. I would strongly recommend you to find another casino. You can check our website and look for recommended casinos for your country.

We’ve reopened this complaint at the request of Betroom 24 Casino. We would like to allow this case one more chance to be resolved and help both parties involved to reach a satisfactory conclusion.

The casino informed us and provided evidence that they have reached a mutual agreement with Benjamin. We are pleased to finally close this case after such a long time.