Savarona Casino - Η απόσυρση του παίκτη ακυρώθηκε.

Dear fowi30,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint and forwarding all the relevant screenshots. I’m sorry to hear about your problem. I have checked terms and conditions, and this is what I found https://savaronacasino.com/en/static-texts/bonus_terms:

„ 9.6. If a player or a group of players are abusing casino bonuses Savarona has the right to confiscate any wins thereof and to close the players account(s). Abusive behaviour towards bonuses and/or bonus abuse means:

i) A Player places bets and/or wagers amounting to the maximum allowed per bonus terms to raise the variance in order increase the balance

ii) Player lowers the bet and/or wager size after a big win and changes the game to one with a lower volatility

iii) Player makes deposits to cap out the bonus amount but not more. Applicable to match bonuses of 50% and above

After the account has been flagged as bonus abusing it is forbidden to use any other bonuses and/or participate in promotions at Savarona."

Could you please forward any other relevant communication that could support this case before we’ll contact the casino and ask for their standpoint? My email address is petronela.k@casino.guru.

I hope we will be able to help you to resolve this issue as soon as possible. Thank you in advance for your reply.

Best regards,

Petronela

the case is clearly the casino is looking for a reason not to pay off.

I ask you how can the casino allow me to deposit all the time with a bonus even though I have no chance of winning. In the event that I lose the bonus, the casino is ok and they let me deposit again week after week with the bonus and as soon as possible you win something refer to this bonus term so that you don't have to pay out. At no time did I have a chance to win anything.

Even if I don't get my winnings paid out, I have the right to get all my deposits of over 1300 euros back because I never had a chance to win anything.

It should also be the responsibility of the casino to stop offering players bonuses if they are not qualified for them or am I wrong?

9.6.iii) After the account has been marked as bonus abuse, it is prohibited to use other bonuses and or to participate in promotions at Savarona.

what about this bonus term? I was never flagged as a bonus abuser so I have to assume that I am qualified for bonuses and that these will also be paid out.

der fall ist ja wohl eindeutig das casino sucht nach einen grund nicht auszuzahlen.

ich frage sie wie kann das casino es zulassen das ich die ganze zeit einzahlen kann mit bonus obwohl ich keine gewinnchanche habe.im falle das ich den bonus verliere ist es für das casino ok und sie lassen mich woche für woche neu einzahlen mit bonus und sobald man etwas gewinnt beziehen sie sich auf diesen bonus term um nicht auszahlen zu müssen.ich hatte zu keiner zeit auch nur eine chanche etwas zu gewinnen.

selbst wenn ich meinen gewinn nicht ausbezahlt kriege habe ich ein recht darauf meine kompletten einzahlungen von über 1300 euro zurück zu erhalten da ich zu keinen zeitpunkt eine chanche hatte etwas zu gewinnen.

es sollte doch auch die verantwortung des casinos sein den spieler keine boni mehr anzubieten wenn er dafür nicht qualifiziert ist oder sehe ich das falsch?

9.6.iii)Nachdem das Konto als Bonusmissbrauch gekennzeichnet wurde, ist es verboten, andere Boni zu verwenden und oder an Werbeaktionen bei Savarona teilzunehmen.

was ist mit diesen bonus term? ich wurde zu keinen zeitpunkt als bonus abuser geflagged so das ich davon ausgehen muss das ich für bonusse qualifiziert bin und diese auch ausgezahlt werden.

Thank you very much, fowi30, for providing all the necessary information. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Peter who will be at your assistance. I wish you best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.

Hi fowi30,

I looked at your case and understand the situation. I will contact the casino and see if I can help. I would like to invite Savarona Casino to the conversation to participate in the resolution of this complaint.

Dear fowi30 and Casino Guru team,

We would like to inform you that the funds were deducted from player's account due to violation of cl. 9.6 and cl. 9.11b of our Bonus Terms and Conditions https://savaronacasino.com/en/static-texts/bonus_terms. The player has made 12 deposits and received 12 deposit bonuses and this can be considered as bonus abusing. According to cl. 9.11b https://savaronacasino.com/en/static-texts/bonus_terms we have the right to restrict the player from receiving bonuses if the player repeatedly made deposits to play in our casino for the sole use of the bonus "Reload bonus of 55% on the Deposit on Fridays" without making deposits and not making bets without the bonus active. According to cl. 9.6 if bonus ratio of received bonuses to his deposits is more than 50% we have the right to confiscate winnings and to close the player's account. For this player it was 58.3 % These bonuses were activated by the player himself. Since winnings were obtained with the bonus that was activated by the player himself and due to violation of our rules funds were deducted from the gaming account. 

Also, we have provided all the information regarding this issue to Casino Guru team email and we hope for a fair solution to this situation.

Warm regards,

Savarona casino team

9.6.iii) After the account has been flagged as bonus abusing it is forbidden to use any other bonuses and / or participate in promotions at Savarona.

I was never flagged as a bonus abuser so I have to assume that I am qualified for a bonus.

it is your responsibility to ban me from bonuses if i am not qualified for them.

In addition, there is nowhere information about how high the current bonus ratio is. How should the player know whether he can use the bonus?

the day before my win, your vip manager writes me for a 100 euro bonus (which I did not use) although my bonus ratio is already too high and I am not even qualified for bonuses.

instead of the bonus from my vip manager, one day later i used the friday reload bonus where the big win of 4000 euros arose. So I had to be able to assume that I was qualified.

I would like to say again how the big win came about

i got lucky with fruit warp very quickly and came up with a high profit on 5 euros stake and my balance was 1,800 euros.

Since I have already had problems in one of their sister casinos pokies2go that has exactly the same bonus conditions as the savaronacasino and published a case at casino guru (https://de.casino.guru/pokies2go-casino-gewinne-aus-dem-bonusspiel- because I changed the slot:

2. ii) The player lowers the stake and / or stake size after a large win and changes the game to a game with less volatility. "

i decided to stay with fruit warp and risked losing all the winnings again but i was lucky and won again and after wagering i had 4000 euro.

what i want to say at that time is if i had changed the slot they would have accused me of that and would not have paid out

2. ii) The player lowers the stake and / or stake size after a large win and changes the game to a game with less volatility. "

But if you continue to play risk and stay with the slot where you were before and win even more, you can use this bonus paragraph in order not to have to pay out:

iii) The player makes deposits to limit the bonus amount, but no more. Applies to bonuses from 50%

no matter how you do it in the end, change the slot or stay in it, you will always find a bonus paragraph to avoid having to pay out

9.6.iii)After the account has been flagged as bonus abusing it is forbidden to use any other bonuses and/or participate in promotions at Savarona.

ich war zu keinen zeitpunkt als bonus abuser geflaggt deshalb muss ich davon ausgehen können das ich für bonus qualifiziert bin.

es liegt in ihrer verantwortung mich für bonusse zu sperren wenn ich nicht dafür qualifiziert bin.

auserdem gibt es nirgends informationen dazu wie hoch die aktuelle bonus ratio ist woher soll der spieler wissen ob er den bonus nutzen darf?

ein tag vor meinen gewinn schreibt mich ihr vip manager an für ein 100 euro bonus (den ich nicht genutzt habe) obwohl meine bonusratio bereits zu hoch ist und ich gar nicht für bonusse qualifiziert bin.

statt dem bonus von meinen vip manager habe ich dann einen tag später den freitag reload bonus genutzt wo der grosse gewinn von 4000 euro entstand. ich musste also davon ausgehen können das ich qualifiziert bin.

ich möchte noch einmal sagen wie es zu dem grossen gewinn kam

ich hatte bei fruit warp recht schnell glück und kam auf 5 euro einsatz zu einen hohen gewinn und meine balance war bei 1800 euro.

da ich schon einmal in einen ihrer schwestercasinos pokies2go das genau die selben bonusbedingungen hat wie das savaronacasino probleme hatte und einen fall bei casino guru veröffentlichte(https://de.casino.guru/pokies2go-casino-gewinne-aus-dem-bonusspiel-wurden) weil ich den slot wechselte:

2. ii) Der Spieler senkt die Einsatz- und / oder Einsatzgröße nach einem großen Gewinn und ändert das Spiel in ein Spiel mit geringerer Volatilität. "

entschied ich mich dazu bei fruit warp zu bleiben und riskierte alle gewinne bei der umsetzung wieder zu verlieren aber ich hatte glück und gewann nochmals und hatte nach wagerumsetzung 4000 euro.

was ich damt sagen will ist wenn ich den slot gewechselt hätte hätten sie mir das vorgeworfen und nicht ausgezahlt

2. ii) Der Spieler senkt die Einsatz- und / oder Einsatzgröße nach einem großen Gewinn und ändert das Spiel in ein Spiel mit geringerer Volatilität. "

wenn man aber weiter risiko spielt und bei dem slot bleibt wo man vorher war und noch mehr gewinnt wendet man diesen bonusparagraphen an um nicht auszahlen zu müssen:

iii) Der Spieler macht Einzahlungen, um den Bonusbetrag zu begrenzen, aber nicht mehr. Gilt für Boni ab 50%

egal wie man es letztendlich macht den slot wechselt oder drin bleibt sie finden immer einen bonusparagraphen um nicht auszahlen zu müssen

Dear Savarona Casino team,

Unfortunately, we see no reason why the player shouldn't get paid in full. 1. how does a player know what his deposit-bonus ratio is? 2. You still let the players take bonuses even though they are not eligible for them. 3. How should a player know that they are not eligible for bonuses when your VIP manager contacts them and offers them more bonuses? From our point of view, if you let players take bonuses, you should pay them their winnings. If you want to exclude players from taking bonuses, don't let them activate any. It's a very simple fix. No player will ever calculate their deposit-bonus ratio.

Dear fowi30 and Casino Guru team,

Let us explain why deduction of funds was correct and as per our rules. 

First of all we do offer deposit for our players for as long as they don't cross the line and take them on every deposit as this player did. He made 12 deposits and received 12 deposit bonuses. The player was waiting every week from Friday to Sunday in order to make a deposit and receive a bonus. He activated not 2 or 5 bonuses but 11 the same bonuses. That's what we call bonus abuse.

Secondly, player may not count his bonus ratio but when he registered on our web site he agreed to our Terms and Conditions and according to cl 9.6 https://savaronacasino.com/en/static-texts/bonus_terms if bonus ratio (amount of received bonuses to his deposits) is more then 50% we have the right to confiscate winnings received from this bonus. Once again let us remind that he received bonus on his first deposit and 11(!) the same deposit bonuses, that player activated every week, while he made 12 deposits. That is purely bonus abusing. The player made 12 deposits and activated 12 deposit bonuses, his bonus ratio is 58.3%. 

Thirdly, the player received cashback from VIP manager, which is not the same as a deposit bonus, it is compensation for his losses. Even though after this he made again a new deposit and activated the deposit bonus. After that he was blocked from receiving bonuses.

We are kindly asking you to reconsider your thoughts on this case. Hope for your understanding.

Warm regards,

Savarona casino team

Hi fowi30 and Savarona Casino team,

Thanks for your replies.

Dear Savarona Team,

I understand your point of view. However, it doesn't really change anything. Let me ask you a question. What unfair advantage did the player get? How much money did he earn from the bonuses before this one? Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe he lost every time. Why didn't you contact him and said, we are sorry, we have to give your money back because you activated too many bonuses and that is against our rules? You didn't because he was losing. And that is the problem. While the player loses, nobody has a problem with it. However, the second he wins, it's against the terms and conditions. This is called a double standard. You let the player activate the bonus despite the fact that he was not eligible for it and therefore he should get paid. We would have no objection if you just banned the player from all bonuses. I'm afraid our decision is final.

Regards,

Peter

The casino sent me an email with the offer to refund all deposits of 1260 euros. I'm a little confused, I am not entitled to the full receipt of my winnings of over 4000 euros

Dear casino guru complaint team

I opened this case here with the aim of receiving my legitimate profit of over 4000 euros but of course I don't want to end up with 0 euros if the casino refuses to pay out the full winnings and instead you accept a deterioration in your reputation .

I don't know what to do right now.

das casino hat mir eine email gesendet mit dem angebot mir alle einzahlungen in höhe von 1260 euro zurück zu erstatten.ich bin etwas verwirrt habe ich nicht einen anspruch auf den vollen erhalt meines gewinnes von über 4000 euro

liebes casino guru complaint team

ich habe diesen fall hier eröffnet mit dem ziel meinen rechtmäßigen gewinn in höhe von über 4000 euro zu erhalten aber natürlich möchte ich am ende auch nicht mit 0 euro da stehen falls sich das casino weigert den vollen gewinn auszuzahlen und sie stattdessen eine verschlechterung ihrer reputation hinnehmen.

ich weiss jetzt gerade nicht was ich machen soll.

Hi fowi30,

We discussed the situation with our management and I sent a message to the casino by Skype. There should be a reply with the casino's final decision soon.

the casino informed me by email of the final decision not to pay out the full profit of 4000 euros.

you are only willing to refund the deposits.

Since I have no other choice, I have agreed to this and am now waiting for the payment of the deposits of 1260 euros + 100 euros that are currently on my game account, a total of 1360 euros.

das casino hat mir per mail die endgültige entscheidung mitgeteilt den vollen gewinn über 4000 euro nicht auszuzahlen.

sie sind lediglich dazu bereit die einzahlungen zurück zu erstatten.

da ich keine andere wahl habe, habe ich dies zugestimmt und warte nun auf die auszahlung der einzahlungen von 1260 euro + 100 euro die sich derzeit auf mein spielaccount befinden insgesamt also 1360 euro.

Dear fowi30 and Casino Guru team,

We will be back soon with an answer regarding this case.

Hope for your understanding.

Warm regards,

Savarona casino team

Dear Savarona Casino team,

You offered to pay the player a refund of his deposits of €1260. When will the player receive his funds?

That is not completely right. You only pay these 1260 euros on the condition that I drop the complaint in order to avoid the bad reputation.

The casino informed me of this by email.

I refuse, however. It's like blackmail if you don't drop the complaint you get the deposits of 1260 euros back, if not you get nothing.

We are not in the Turkish bazaar or make a wish what the casino seems to believe.

It's not just about the money, it's also important to me that other players are warned when they play at this casino.

Das ist nicht ganz richtig. Sie zahlen diese 1260 Euro nur unter der Voraussetzung aus wenn ich die Beschwerde fallen lasse um die schlechte Reputation zu umgehen.

Dies hat mir das Casino per Mail mitgeteilt.

Ich lehne das allerdings ab.das ist ja wie eine Erpressung wenn sie die Beschwerde nicht fallen lassen kriegen sie die Einzahlungen von 1260 euro zurück,wenn nicht kriegen sie gar nix.

Wir sind hier nicht auf dem türkischen Basar oder bei wünsch dir was wie es das Casino zu glauben scheint.

es geht mir nicht nur um das Geld es ist mir auch wichtig das andere Spieler gewarnt sind wenn sie in diesen Casino spielen.

Dear fowi30 and Casino Guru team,

We would like to inform you that the funds in the amount of 1260 EUR were successfully returned to the player's gaming balance on 01.06. The player was notified by mail.

As previously mentioned, unfortunately, we are unable to return the winnings from the bonus to the player, namely 4096.50 EUR, since we strictly follow our policies and can not ignore the rules of the site. Moreover, the player has agreed to our terms and conditions when registering on the site. That is why our final decision was to return the full amount of deposits that the player made to receive bonuses in our casino.

We also want to emphasize that the player was not blackmailed and there was no mention that the money will not be returned to him if he does not close the complaint. He was politely asked to duplicate his reply on the forum that he told us by mail.

We are looking forward to hearing about the solution for this case.

Sincerely,

Savarona casino team

Hi all, thank you for your replies.

Dear Savarona team,

I saw the email you sent to the player and that's why I understand his reaction.

Dear fowi30,

Please let me know when you receive your funds.

i received my 1360 euro money (the deposits) today

ich habe mein geld in höhe von 1360 euro (die einzahlungen) heute erhalten

Thank you fowi30 for the update. I'm glad to hear that you received your deposits.

As mentioned several times above, we are convinced that the player should get paid in full. Since the casino decided to only refund the player's deposits, we will deduct that amount from the disputed amount of this complaint (there will be fewer black points) but we will still close the case as unresolved. If the casino's decision changes, the complaint can be reopened at any time.

Best regards,

Peter